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Excessive Oil Consumption on 2AZ-FE Engine LSC ZE7

Discussion in 'Warranty Extensions' started by OishiiJPN, Jan 5, 2015.

  1. Eric Renfro

    Eric Renfro Guest

    Why does this "test" use such extreme formulas to discern whether or not to fix an actual real problem? At 1,000 miles, 1.2qt is seriously very high, like should never happen. Technically if your car even looses even 1/4th of that amount there's technically a serious problem.

    I went into my local dealership because after 7,000mi since my last oil change on Full Synthetic Valvoline SynPower 0w20 oil in my 2008 Scion xB, I start seeing my oil light turn on when I brake harder than normal, because when I got home, let the engine cool down properly, and checked my oil level, it didn't even register on the dipstick, meaning there was < 1.5qt of oil left in the oil reservoir. To me, this is an extremely serious issue. To note, this problem has been progressively getting worse each oil change, confirmable from each time, before I get the oil change I get a reading of the oil level, and the oil change place always reports my oil lower than normal (but until this time, it's always been at least in the OK level).

    Fact of the matter is though, a car shouldn't be burning anywhere close to even 1/4th of 1.2qt, let alone 1.2qt itself, before being a problem.

    This almost sounds like a ploy to get people to go to the Toyota dealership, spend money to get oil services done there, come back and get a followup diagnostic which may or may not cost you ~$110 to get done, just to investigate a more-than-severely-serious oil issue that's way over acceptable.

    I'm more than interested, reading about this, to join in on the class action lawsuit over this, because this is honestly horrible, and I would've never bought my car had I known it would consume this much oil before even hitting 100,000 miles. (currently at ~70,000, primarily used in-town to/from work).

    Eric
     
  2. ScionARA Bee

    ScionARA Bee New Member

    Sorry about that. It's my first time here.

    Just want to share this video to y'all. Although I passed my first oil consumption test on my '09 Scion xB, I want to warn everyone to verify the oil dipstick yourself before they seal it, and please let me add, also when they check it for the final reading. I know, we're supposed to TRUST our PROFESSIONAL TOYOTA MECHANIC, but we're NOT IN JAPAN! Isn't that SAD! I will get another oil consumption test later on with a more watchful eye, before they put the seal and after they break the seal for a final reading. And yes, I was not able to verify the oil level on the dipstick when the mechanic did the final check. SHAME ON ME! But, NEVER AGAIN!

     
    OishiiJPN likes this.
  3. OishiiJPN

    OishiiJPN Administrator

    The Dealer didn't even perform the test properly. They are supposed to use actual sealing material and not just mark the cap. Lewis showed what the seals look like in his reply here..


    I wanted to add that you can ask to be present and inspect the oil level before the Dealer seals the engine up. Also when they remove the seals to check the oil level when you return. It's your car and if you want to be there, why not? They should have no objections.

    Also if you want to see what this repair look like with the pistons being replaced (a lot of times the short block gets replaced) here...

     
  4. ScionARA Bee

    ScionARA Bee New Member

    Thank you Oishii San. I'll make sure that I'm present for my next Oil Consumption Test.
     
  5. JJ101

    JJ101 Guest

    I just to let you know what I've gone through and how disappointed I am in Toyota.

    My car burns oil but not enough for Toyota to fix it. I was told I need to replace the engine to stop the oil burning. Need to replace the engine, yet Toyota does not think it burns enough to replace it. I am shocked. The only way to fix it is to replace the engine. Is this correct? This should be a recall, not extended warranty. I bought a Toyota, not a Kia. I'm poor, I can't put a new engine in the car. And we all know it's going to get worse.


    It started and my car only had 88,000 miles on it.


    I thought I got the deal of my life when I bought this car. Turns out, I got one big pain in the ass money sucking car. The car burns 3/4 of a qt every 1200 miles. Toyota says; sorry won't fix it. Very sad they can get away with this. As a poor man, I cannot afford to fix it. (I sold what I had of value to buy it. Largest Willie Nelson song collection. Every song Willie released and a few he didn't)


    FWB Toyota dealer said I had 3 oil leaks thatI needed to fix before they would do the test. ($1,415.00) No oil on the ground where I park but 3 oil leaks? I wanted to come up and look for myself and they said ok, but you may be here 3-5 hours. We have to fix other cars first. (I borrowed the money to fix the imaginary leaks. This will take me 15 plus months to pay back.) Steven Shea the advisor said spending the $1400.00 would save me $6000.00.


    My Firestone oil guy says no way I had oil leaks. Who do you believe? Toyota of FWB? Firestone? I trust the 70 year old guy that changes my oil and has for years. If I need something done on the car, he'll come get me. I talk to him in the parking lot after every visit. So, according to Toyota of FWB, my car had to spring 3 leaks within 3901 miles and 93 days after my last oil change. (Do you even believe that?) I've talked to other mechanic's. ALL said no way.


    Aug 3rd, 2016 -


    Toyota pissed me off by saying they did the oil test again (yesterday) and did not or lied about the oil consumption results. When I got the car back they said it only burnt 3/4 qt. Today I looked under the hood and saw the oil markings were still on my car. I could not pull the dip stick out. (see photo) NO I'M NOT KIDDING. THEY HAD MY CAR TWO HOURS AND WHEN I WENT TO STEVE SHEA TO ASK HOW MUCH LONGER, HE HIMSELF DROVE IT OUT. LEFT IT RUNNING IN THE PARKING LOT. WHEN I ASKED HOW MUCH IT BURNT, HE SAID 3/4 OF A QT.


    Back to the 3rd.

    I went back to Toyota and had them check the oil. They said they put a qt of oil in it and then checked the level. 1/2 - 3/4 of a qt low after Toyota guy checked it. Meaning, if Toyota did the test the day before as they said they did or my car would to have been over 1.5 qt's low and they did not put the other half - 3/4 qt in to fill it up. Yet they would not approve it to get my car fix for free by Toyota or admit they did not do the test. Meaning they never looked at it and the oil was still low when they gave it back to me. So now I have to do it all over again and they really don't care about my inconvenience and stress of this car. I was very upset and made it known. Steven Shea the advisor said he would not give me the paperwork until I said PLEASE. Are you kidding me! They charged me for something I did not need. (Oil leaks and he wants me to be nice?) Did not do the second test and they do not care. Yet they want me to say please. My anxiety and blood pressure were sky high. PEOPLE NEED TO BE FIRED OVER THERE. STARTING WITH STEVEN SHEA (Advisor) AND (Vaughn Nadeau) for not having the guts, the balls to tell me the test was not done properly or for them lying about the oil consumption and not letting my car get fixed for free. He and two other employees would rather lie to me then fess up. What is wrong with these people?


    I will die without a good working car. I bought a Toyota because of the reputation. Camry, best selling most relievable car for years. (Till I buy one.) I guess this is God's way of saying he hates me a little more.

    I have many out of town doctor appointment through the year. I need a reliable car.

    I can't sell this car because I'm honest and will tell them it burns oil. I can't trade it in because my income will not support a loan.


    Other issues:


    I'm on my 4th car battery. Car has 94,000 miles. No one can tell me why they don't last. Vaughn Nadeau of Toyota says it's the heat. I almost laughed at him.

    I had other cars in Florida. Never had to buy a battery every 26 months. (On average)


    Gas mileage went from 22.5/35 to 19/29 I'm assuming because of the oil issue

    Tires wear out fast and I rotate and alignment every 5000 miles.

    Wiper motor went under warrantee.

    Second set of front brakes/rotors - 93,000 (OK I guess)

    Second set rear brakes/rotors 63,000


    Of the 4 cars I've owned this is the only car I had to put oil in. (In-between oil changes)

    I told a girl that works at the dealership all of the above. She said; sometimes it happens. You get a bad car.
     
  6. Lewis Kline

    Lewis Kline New Member

    Here's my story. I have had this test completed, failed and had the engine corrected. Prior to that I had added oil or had the oil changed on schedule.
    Now, just two days ago, the balance shaft bears spun and came apart, and the lower oil pan is now contaminated with metal. I suspect this is directly due to the oil issue that put abnormal wear and tear on these bearings due to the oil not being at the level it should have been. It is going to cost 3600 dollars to just change the oil pan, pump, and balance shafts...and 6500 if I also want the short block removed and cleaned to ensure there is no metal pieces that will further damage the engine.
    Kelley blue book lists that car trade in value at 4,000 - 6,000, so I am basically paying almost, if not more, than what the car is worth on trade. It is my opinioni this should be covered since it was the neglect of toyota in building the engine correct at the factory that has led to this catastrophy (as well as putting down to a one car family with two people who need a car). I am not sure what to do, I am car hunting now at the dealership in hopes they will give me something for what is now pretty much junk. A car in good shape with no engine. My fear is that if I have the repairs done now, something else will fail down the road with the engine due to the uncessary stress it's been through. The car has 148,000 miles on it, not a lot by todays standards. Needless to say, I am not happy with my local dealer, or with Toyota as a company.
     
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  7. OishiiJPN

    OishiiJPN Administrator

    Lewis, how long has it been since the ZE7 repair was performed? If it's been under a year(unlimited mileage), then this should be covered by Toyota. Yours is not the first vehicle to have the balance shafts and/or thrust washer come apart after this repair was performed. While it is not something we see often, we do indeed see it happen. Here are some pics of what you may see if you going into the Dealer and have them show you your vehicle....

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This pictures above are from one that returned to the dealer with a vibration and loud noise complaint 4 moths after the ZE7 repair was performed. The Technicians inspected the vehicle and found that the balance shafts came apart and took out the thrust washer (the semi circular metal part seen in the first picture). Toyota took care of the customer and installed a new short block and balance shafts at no cost to the customer. The last picture above is what new balance shafts look like when being installed.

    You need to bring this to the attention of Toyota Corp and especially the Area Manager for your Dealer as these have the power to correct this for you. The Technician and your Dealer would love to put in a new short block/balance shafts because Toyota would pay them to do it but they can't make that decision on their own. They need approval from Toyota.

    Now remember, the problem here is that we need this fixed and focusing on assigning blame wont help. Did the old parts just fail? Did the Technician do something wrong by not following the repair manual? Did the Technician not see that these balance shafts were damaged before reinstalling them? The fact is, we don't know. What we know is that the repair was performed and this ruined engine is the result. If it's been under one year (which is what most Toyota repairs are covered for) then Toyota should approve your Dealer to install a new short block with balance shafts.
     
  8. Lewis Kline

    Lewis Kline New Member

    Thank you for the reply. The service was performed and completed on July 27, 2016. I am not trying to lay blame on anyone but when it's mentioned that they recommend the balance shafts be checked, then this should be a part of the repair. Any automobile that has engine oil troubles run the possiblity of additional issues, and since they knew about this a a major problem, it should be covered. I agree. I will bring this up with the service department that it should be escalated to the Area Manager and Toyota Corp. I have no idea whom that might be or even how to begin contacting Toyota Corp. Again, thanks for the reply, that is good information.
     
    OishiiJPN likes this.
  9. OishiiJPN

    OishiiJPN Administrator

    In Dealer parlance, the person you need to speak too is the DFOM, District Fixed Ops Manager. You can find out who your Dealers DFOM is by talking to the Service Director. You should first open a case with Toyota by contacting them here..

    Make sure you write down the case number that Toyota gives you, so you have a reference. Then contact your Dealer's Service Director (not service manager) and ask to speak about your vehicle with him/her and the DFOM. This should get the ball rolling. Now remember to be firm in what it is you want (car fixed) but also nice. Never threaten or mention lawyers as this just shuts the conversation down. Seriously, they will just say to have your lawyer contact their lawyer and that's that. The end.

    Again, it's not about blame. Everyone just wants the car fixed and you to continue being a Toyota customer. Without customers, we don't have jobs.
     
  10. I am considering buying a 2009 Camry I found that is a good deal. I am going to look at it today but I don't know much about it yet, except it is low miles (60-70k). However this oil consumption problem makes me very hesitant. Is it foolish for me to even consider this car?

    I have some general questions:
    *Is the problem in EVERY 2007-2009 Camry 4 cylinder?
    *This seems a little redundant but I'll ask anyway...Will this oil consumption problem happen to every Camry 4 cylinder eventually (in that year range)?
    *Is it only engines manufactured in certain plants or ALL 4 cylinder engines no matter where manufactured (because it is a design flaw)?
    *Are there some of these Camry 4 cylinders that have never experienced this problem (simply by fluke)?

    Thanks in advance for your guidance.
     
  11. OishiiJPN

    OishiiJPN Administrator

    No

    Yes.

    Yes, a design flaw with the pistons.

    Yes, we do see quite a few engines that pass the test. They still burn oil but just not enough to qualify for the warranty extension.

    One thing you will want to check on is the vehicle history with Toyota. If you give your local Dealer the VIN number, they can search TIS and see what if any repairs were performed at any Dealer. They can also see if this Camry has the original engine installed in it. The engine serial number is located at the rear of the engine near the bell housing.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Francisco

    Francisco Guest

    Hi I'm having the same issue, My 2008 Scion TC has 114,000 miles on it and was going through 2 quarts in a span of a couple hundred miles, I took it to the dealership and they said it did fall under the warranty enhancement however the broken piston they found inside the engine they are saying it was because I ran the engine very hard which is not true, I know how to take care of my car and have since I bought it. But due to that broken piston Toyota is refusing to fix the engine even tho it falls under their warranty enhancement program. Im furious they refuse to take the blame and fix the issue they caused, please get back to me about any advice or questions, im desperate for some information about this!
     
  13. David R.

    David R. Guest

    Great website with great information! I just bought my son an '08 Scion TC with 84K miles on it back in May of 2016 and within a month he called to tell me his oil light came on. Needless to say, I'll spare y'all the details of adding oil, checking oil, being amazed at the oil consumption, etc. What I am wondering is if the Toyota "Warranty Enhancement" applies only to the original purchaser or would it extend to the Scion we just purchased as the second owner? Any help is much appreciated!
    Thank you in advance!
     
    Lewis likes this.
  14. Lewis

    Lewis Moderator Staff Member

    The warranty enhancement applies to the vehicle itself, regardless if you are the original owner or the 5th, 6th etc.
     
  15. Lewis

    Lewis Moderator Staff Member

    Lewis, did you ever follow through with this? I'm curious how it turned out.
     
  16. camryocto

    camryocto New Member

    Anybody else has long wait after car admitted into the dealership? Two weeks after my Camry failed the consumption test, the service advisor called and said the parts were ready. After they took the engine apart, however, they said they were short of one piston in stock... And it has been almost two months. I'm glad that the rental is covered. But anyone has the same problem or has any idea when the parts will be ready?? Thanks...
     
  17. so2315

    so2315 Guest

    I just started the oil consumption test on my 2007 with 185,000 miles on it. I have changed oil religiously with 0W-20 Mobil 1. It seems to use a quart about every 600 miles. The dealer changed the oil, and used 5w-30 oil. My question is this: I know it uses oil, but what is the best way to expedite the oil use? 1100 miles of driving in town with stop and go, or driving 1100 miles on the hwy at 75 mph? I have heard both arguments. I only ask because of the short window I have to fail the test which ends in October due to the mileage I have.
     
  18. Lewis

    Lewis Moderator Staff Member

    This question is asked quite frequently. If I had to pick a method to "encourage" oil usage, I would just have the engine at a high idle in the driveway. This way if the engine does use oil, it would do so without putting miles on the car.
     
  19. Lewis Kline

    Lewis Kline New Member

    Thank you for all the good information. I was in contact with Toyota Corporate and the person on the other end of the phone stated nothing would/coiuld be done because this wasn't part of the original test. I explained that was alright but that I would escalate the issue up the chain. The next day, while on my way home I receive a call from the dealership and they are going to fix it for free and will hash it out with corporate to get it covered. I appreciate the support in telling me to stand firm, and not give in. I am waiting for parts and the repair, it's about 10 days since this decision and plan on calling them today for a status.
    Thanks again for everything!
     
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  20. OishiiJPN

    OishiiJPN Administrator

    Thanks for sticking with this and for the Update! It's nice to see this work out for you. :D
     

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